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Greatest Male Songwriter

   Discussion: Greatest Male Songwriter
Zach · 20 years, 10 months ago

Just to conform to the latest topic, I shall add thissun. Who is the greatest male songwriter? I would have a tough time choosing between Elliott Smith, Paul Simon, and Peter Mulvey. Thoughts?

Josh Woodward Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
peterpeterpeter
Andrea Krause Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
Add a few Peters on there for me. The Peter Queen. :)
100% dainty! Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
pumpkin eater
Andrea Krause Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
Has a wife and he will keep her! :)
Nik Chaikin · 20 years, 10 months ago
as i said before. he has such versatility and rang!. He can do any style he damn well wants!
Zach Back · 20 years, 10 months ago

I must say, though, I was disappointed with his latest work. I mean, come on:

"Trust your intuition / It's just like goin' fishin'"

Worst. Simile. EVER.

Zach · 20 years, 10 months ago

Damn, I almost forgot Bobs Dylan and Marley. How could I do such a thing?

George E. Nowik · 20 years, 10 months ago

johnny cash?� paul simon?

�-= george =-

nitsita Back · 20 years, 10 months ago

I have to go with Paul Simon... maybe Rufus Wainwright�in English...

But I have to go with Pierre Lapointe, Boris Vian, Jacques Brel�as greatest...

Shelly Back · 20 years, 10 months ago

*1,000 shellypoints� for mentioning the man in black*

WTG, norg!!!!

100% dainty! · 20 years, 10 months ago
the thing with this discussion, is are we talking about singer/songwriter?� because if not. . . i would think that all the classical greats count as songwriters. they are more "composers" yes, but they are writing songs. so that's a whole new slew of ppl to choose from.
Nik Chaikin Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
DONT complicate this! it's hard enough as is.
no one Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
Damn! I was just about to mention Johann Sebastian Bach.
hkath · 20 years, 10 months ago
I have to say Dan Bern. I know it's unoriginal, but I have to because a) I really think it and b) it's my duty.
Gordondon son of Ethelred · 20 years, 10 months ago
Going for greatest Male song writer is more difficult, it is largely a matter of what type of music you like. My number 1 would be Dylan but Dylan says that Hank Williams was the greatest. The guys that would have to be on my top ten list are: (note there are several duos on the list)


  1. George and Ira Girshwin

  2. Rogers and Hart and or Hammerstein

  3. Woody Guthrie

  4. Leadbelly

  5. Cole Porter

  6. Bob Dylan

  7. Lennon/McCartney

  8. Paul Simon

  9. Jagger/Richards

  10. Springsteen


Wow that's actually ten. Jazz is underrepresented. Perhaps Duke Ellington belongs. Perhaps Sachmo or Coltrane. The problem with Jazz is that songwriting is not at the core of the art.

One hallmark of great songwriters is that other people can perform their works and make it their own. All of these people have been covered. Springsteen is probably the one that I'm least confident in placing on the list. I can see Dave Carter entering this company with time. His stature has been grown since his death and other performers interpret his work.
Shelly Back · 20 years, 10 months ago

dwd!!!� no hoopoe on your list????

*shocker*

Gordondon son of Ethelred Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
As you know Richard Thompson is a huge personal favorite. I was erring on the side of caution. He did write the greatest song ever, 1952 VBL and is has been covered a few times recently. I should have at least put him in the Dave Carter category though.

When Pete Kennedy talks about great songwriters he always says, Dylan, Richard Thompson, and Dave Carter.
George E. Nowik Back · 20 years, 10 months ago

thank you for adding the gershwin name.

how 'bout irving berlin? (:

�-= george =-

Gordondon son of Ethelred Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
I thought about him but when it comes down to it I hate his stuff. God Bless America is godawful. He really was a forerunner of the pop pandering to the audience school of songwriting. To put it less harshly his work lacks the depth both musically and lyrically of the others on the list.

George E. Nowik Back · 20 years, 10 months ago

he does have some hot points tho.� blue skies comes to mind .. the songs themselves may not have been perfect, but they were good enough vehicles to be performed by some amazing folks...� and they sounded pretty darn amazing.� under the crust..

�-= george =-

goovie is married! Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
yay for adding the gershwins, r&h/h, and cole porter. i would add richard thompson and, like, you said, eventually dave carter.
nate... · 20 years, 10 months ago
Certainly.

Mulvey is also great.
jaye Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
word.

um. that's all. i just have a lot of tom love :)
nitsita Back · 20 years, 10 months ago

oh.

yeah.

forgot him.

Yvonne · 20 years, 10 months ago
Jian!� Actually to tell the truth I have no clue.� Although if it were cutest male songwriter...
jaye Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
. . .then it -still- wouldn't be jian :P
Yvonne Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
Sure sure.� That's what you think.� :P� (Hee hee.)
emilie is CRANKY Back · 20 years, 10 months ago

*chases jaci off with a big stick*

:D

Yvonne Back · 20 years, 10 months ago

*finds an even bigger stick and joins in*

:D

jaye Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
o.O

kinky.
Samantha · 20 years, 10 months ago
Jim Croce... Jim is the MAN... of course i could definatly go for Arlo Guthrie, Paul Simon, and Tim Buckley
Bruce Rose Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
These are great topics for discussion. I have to second Jim Croce. All of his songs are incredible, he doesn't lock into a certain style, and ... I'm having trouble finishing the triple, but it's great stuff.

I'm intentionally keeping quiet in these forums, since I usually focus more on the delivery than who wrote the message. But I'm reading them avidly.
Shelly · 20 years, 10 months ago

and some of them have already been mentioned, so if you mentioned them, i agree with you.� so word!!!! {*note* these are not in order, necessarily.� and i didn't list, like cole porter or the gershwins coz in my opinion, they're composers, not mere song writers...diff genres..blablabla}

~springsteen.�� coz.� yeah.

~johnny cash.� the man in black rocks.

~dave carter.� nuff said.

~townes van zandt.� arguments???

~woody guthrie.� this land is my land, this land is his land.

~peter mulvey. agreed.

~robbie schaefer. no picking on me.� no saying 'biased!!'.� the schaef-meister can write.{i also think mike's stuff is good, too, but i know i'd be pushing the envelope with that one ;)� }

~john hiatt.� for 'your love is my rest' and -so- much more......

~paul mccartney and john lennon. eleanor rigby and others too numerous to mention.

i know i forgot someone and i'll be sad later.� but i can always re-post, eh?

{ps~hey,care~ did davy -write- *loff*??� or 'the day we fall in love'??� *guffaw*}

goovie is married! Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
no, but he *did* write "war games!" :)
Shelly Back · 20 years, 10 months ago

teehee

~iMMEDIATELY goes into 'bob dylan singing 'wargames'~

hkath Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
Oh crap! How did I forget John Hiatt!
I can see the bunny Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
- Tom Waits
- Gordon Lightfoot
- John Martyn
- Bruce Cockburn
- Dan Bern
- Bob Dylan
- Ron Sexsmith
- Stephen Fearing
- Danny Michel
- John Lennon/Paul McCartney (separate and together)

Who can decide? Actually tough to stop. ;)
Gordondon son of Ethelred · 20 years, 10 months ago
If you asked songwriters to list their favorites Randy Newman would rank high. He is a throwback as unlike most of the postwar songwriters he is best known for other people interpreting is work.

I wasn't sure what to do about Stephan Sondheim. Is it his songs that are great or the way he weaves them into musicals? His collaboration with Leonard Bernstein on West Side Story produced some of the greatest songs ever.
Andrea Krause Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
Yep. Peter Mulvey's always pushing me to get into Randy Newman. :)
soul groove feline · 20 years, 10 months ago

Dave Carter. a million times Dave Carter. He has created some of the most incredible beauty i have seen in this world yet.

also on my list of veryveryvery good:
-Dan Bern
-Peter Mulvey
-Bruce Cockburn (for writing the best song ever, Lovers In A Dangerous Time)

Talcott · 20 years, 10 months ago
Paul Simon (mostly from the Simon and Garfunkel years, not so much solo)

Peter Mulvey

Dan Bern (excluding much of 50 Eggs, which I balme on Ani DeFranco)

Andy Partridge

Mike Ford (he wins on account of Independence Day alone)

nate... Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
If you blame it on Ani, does that mean it's his only well-written stuff?

Cuz, like, I've heard other stuff by him that's well written.
Talcott Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
Other way around. I'm blaming the songs I don't like on Ani. It might or might not be her fault, but much of that album sounds very forced to me. None of his other albums have that feel.
100% dainty! Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
I thought Independence Day was a murray song. . . .
goovie is married! Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
murray sings it, but i believe mike wrote it.
Nathan Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
I'll agree with Andy Partridge.� He's also one of my favorite male singers.� Pretty much The Man, as far as my personal favorite musicians go.
angelmusicmaven · 20 years, 10 months ago

I think "greatest" is a bit of a grandiose and pretentious term for my peeps... and most of the peeps I know aren't pretentious... I just think they're super talented... so here I go... Elvis Costello Bob Dylan Ron Sexsmith Andy Stochansky (wasn't always, but getting there) Matthew Sweet (also a nice progression) Dan Navarro (Lowen & Navarro) Steve Dawson (Dolly Varden) Jeff Tweedy (Wilco) Mike Nesmith�NEIL FINN�Luka Bloom Adam Levy (Honeydogs) Marty Sexton ain't bad either...

jaye Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
yesyesyes. especially elvis, neil, & jeff.
J · 20 years, 10 months ago

Mr.E from the Eels

or Jim Bob Injustice from Carter USM

angelmusicmaven Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
oh yeah, E is cool.� I really like his first single from his first solo CD (probably released about 10 or 11 years ago no?) "Hello Cruel World."� I just really love that line "What the hell/Hello cruel world"
Doktor Pepski, kommie · 20 years, 10 months ago

Bono and the edge- every song evokes somekind of a mood be it political to love to fear of a technological revolution.

Lennon/McCartney- Gods amonugst men. It is almost as if they made a pact with the devil to have such a run of music

Springsteen- God amoungst the common man, a man trying to make his voice heard be it to an uncaring gov't or to a neighborhood woman.

Gershwin- "rhapsody in blue" enough said

Paul Simon- The soul of the 60's counter culture.

Billy Joel- A long Island man and his piano, just singing aboot life, really nothing more, but always great to listen to.

goovie is married! Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
do we have a thread for best male singers? bono definitely belongs in there. his vocal and emotional ranges are incredible.
Gordondon son of Ethelred · 20 years, 10 months ago
Somebody has to mention Bowie, a unique talent.
nate... Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
Bowie is another "glad people cover him" person.
:)

He did write some good songs, tho.
Gordondon son of Ethelred · 20 years, 10 months ago
I'm surprised that nobody mentioned Leonard Cohen, one of the great poet/songwriters.
I can see the bunny Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
Ack! I can't believe I left him off my list! Also forgot to mention Willie P. Bennett!
Gordondon son of Ethelred Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
You were the person I figured would be most likely ot mention him. You or Stacey
I can see the bunny Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
I know! *hangs head in shame*
goovie is married! Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
eep, yes, leonard cohen.
and nick drake, people. nick drake.
i'll throw in a vote for andrew bird for the future greats...god, can that man write.
Eri · 20 years, 10 months ago
Leonard Cohen. :) I'll get back to you on others.
Eri Back · 20 years, 10 months ago

BILL BOURNE!

I can't believe I didn't mention him. If I were on my deathbed, I would want Bill Bourne to come and play/sing for me, and that would soothe me. Quite honestly.

Gordondon son of Ethelred · 20 years, 10 months ago
The songwriters who i think are never given their full due are those that came between the standards writers, Cole Porter et al and the singsongwriters. I mentioned Ellie Greenwich on the female songwriters list but there are others. Many of them worked out of the Brill Building in New York. There are a number of women in the group so I could have put this post on that thread too.

To give an example of the kinds of songs these people wrote I'll give some of Jerry Lieber and Mike Stollers greatest hits.

  • Hound Dog

  • Charlie Brown

  • Jailhouse Rock

  • Yakkety Yak

  • Love Potion #9

  • Stand by Me (With Ben E. King)

  • On Broadway

  • Poison Ivy

  • Stuck in the Middle with You


Some other writers of the era were Carole King & Bernie Goffin and Barry Mann & Cynthia Weil.
goovie is married! Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
carol king and *gerry* goffin, even.
mann & weil might not be as well known...like goffin & king (who deserve immortality for "the porpoise song" alone), they wrote many songs recorded by the monkees. mann & weil are also responsible for the songs on the soundtrack to wild in the streets, which is a great movie about what's going to happen when wild and crazy teenagers take over the country and put lsd into senators' drinking water.
Gordondon son of Ethelred Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
OK where did "Bernie" come from? Somehow this is Bernardo Jose's fault.

Yay for Wild in the Streets!

I saw the film when I was twelve or so and we loved the idea of 14-year-olds voting.

14 OR FIGHT!
goovie is married! Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
neal and i are always talking about attending large gatherings and carrying big signs that say that, and "52%!" and "max frost for president." :)
Gordondon son of Ethelred Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
We need Max Frost Bumper Stickers for the 2004 Elections.
goovie is married! Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
dude. we're opening a cafepress store for that.
actually, we need to open up a cafepress store for a lot of reasons. but yeah.
Nik Chaikin Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
I'm gonna try an get a Pastrami sandwich on the ballot in '04. i figure it'd be better than Bush, but iknow it'll never get elected. After all, it's jewish
Arbie Back · 20 years, 10 months ago

Many, many people worked in the Brill building. Neil Sedaka wrote "Oh Carol" while he was there (for Carol King whom he had a crush on). Neil Diamond wrote several hits there. Lots of others.....

Gordondon son of Ethelred Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
Lieber and Stoller are going to be featured on American Routes this weekend. Listen to it.
jaye Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
gordon. edit whatever you did to turn the forum blue.
Gordondon son of Ethelred · 20 years, 10 months ago
Warren Zevon died yesterday. A year ago he was given one month to live. In that last year he put out his last album Life Will Kill You He'll be missed.
goovie is married! Back · 20 years, 10 months ago
absolutely. it's easy to think of him as just "the guy who wrote 'werewolves of london' and 'lawyers, guns, and money'" but there was much more to him than that.
Rachel Beck · 20 years, 10 months ago
I'm in agreement on Dylan, McCartney/Lennon, Leonard Cohen, Woody Guthrie, and Cole Porter.

How 'bout Hoagie Carmichael and Pete Seeger?
Arbie · 20 years, 10 months ago

I really can't argue with any of the names mentioned up to now. My choices partly depend on whether my mood has me listening more to the words or the tunes. Of course the best songs are strong in both.

I guess considering this group that its not odd that we should be biased towards the folk side of things. Still it's hard to believe I'm the first to mention Stevie Wonder.

Back on the folk side.... nobody has mentioned Dan Fogelberg.

And Neil Young. Mostly for his CSNY stuff, but also for his other acoustic stuff.

Willie Nelson.

In the showing promise category: Babyface. On the basis of the work he did on the Waiting to Exhale soundtrack. Solid songwriting chops.

Gordondon son of Ethelred · 20 years, 10 months ago
I saw My Fair Lady for the umpteenth time tonight and that alone would make Lerner and Loewe immortals. Does any other musical have so many great songs?


1. Overture: Orchestra/Why Can't the English?
2. Wouldn't It Be Loverly?
3. With a Little Bit of Luck
4. I'm an Ordinary Man
5. Just You Wait
6. Rain in Spain
7. I Could Have Danced All Night
8. Ascot Gavotte
9. On the Street Where You Live
10. You Did It
11. Show Me
12. Get Me to the Church on Time
13. Hymn to Him
14. Without You
15. I've Grown Accustomed to Her Face

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